The early morning chill had yet to leave the stone hut deep in northern Iraq's Qandil mountains as the guerrillas of the Kurdistan Workers Party gathered for their morning discussion on politics.
"The United States wants democracy in Iraq and there have been some positive developments there with Saddam leaving," said Yasser Bagok, one of the loosely organised PKK band's subcommanders, in his comments on the day's reading.
"America is playing an important role in the development of democracy in the Middle East despite its mistakes," agreed Sozdor Serbiliz, the female commander who led the day's discussion.
"For Europe, we cannot say the same thing." The words at first appear odd for what was once a hard-core Marxist-Leninist movement that has fought the Turkish government in a brutal guerrilla war since 1984, but now maintains it is committed to a peaceful solution to the Kurdish question.
"We have concrete solutions to the problems of the region and we can play an important role in developing democracy," Serbiliz told the two dozen guerrillas huddled against the cold as raindrops spattered against the plastic sheeting draped over the hut.
"Outsiders cannot develop democracy in the region, we must do it ourselves," she said. Rather than seeking to carve out a separate Kurdish state, the PKK says it now seeks a peaceful solution for Kurdish identity within each of the four countries Iraq, Iran, Turkey and Syria where Kurds live.
The meeting began with a reading of the latest missive from the movement's founder, Abdullah Ocalan, who has been languishing in a Turkish prison for the past six years.
Serbiliz read in a rapid monotone. The rambling tract moved from topic to topic, occasionally quoting philosophers such as Immanuel Wallerstein, and discussed the politics in the region, even referring to the Democratic Party's victory in the US mid-term elections. Ocalan has a near godlike status in the movement, with his picture everywhere in PKK facilities and only competing for wall space with the faces of the martyrs killed in their many battles.
After the reading, the guerrillas immediately stood and briskly applauded. Turkey, the arch foe of the movement that continues to pressure the Iraqi government to expel the PKK from its mountain hideaways, came in for repeated condemnation in the "leader's" dispatch.
"Turkey's problem is that there is no freedom of thought or organisation. That's why Turkey cannot develop itself in many ways, politically and economically," said the letter. Ocalan also criticised the European Union for trying to force Turkey to solve the situation in Cyprus, but not doing anything for the oppressed Kurds in Turkey.
At the same time, he noted that many Turkish politicians and intellectuals did believe in a peaceful solution to the whole Kurdish issue. In the discussions, though, the young fighters, few above the age of 22 and many still in their teens, cautioned against giving up the military option.
"The whole time we are calling for a ceasefire, (the Turks) are increasing their operations and say they are going to finish off the PKK," said Sema Zilan, a woman with a royal blue scarf holding back her long, curly hair. "We have to prepare ourselves both politically and militarily, because it seems they are increasing military operations against us."
The young guerrillas also discussed their relations with the two dominant parties in the Iraqi Kurdish region the Kurdish Democratic Party and the Patriotic Union of Kurdistan. They have criticised both for being too conservative and tribally based.
"These differences have to be overcome," noted one man, yet "not everyone talks in the same way. If everyone talked the same, there would be no development in society".
The PKK has its own associated party operating in Iraq's Kurdish autonomous region, the Kurdish Democratic Solution Party. However, its followers say they often face interference from the authorities. In response to Turkish pressure, the Iraqi government ordered the closure of the party's offices in Iraq in September. "Turkey says close and Iraq closes them. What happened to democracy? There is no democracy when it comes to us," said another of the guerrillas.