Elections that are fair and that can be measured: senator says nuclear security part of discussion with Musharraf

The following is the text of conference call briefing with Senator John Kerry (D-MA) and Senator Charles Hagel(R-NE)on their upcoming trip to Pakistan, Afghanistan and India.
SENATOR KERRY: Senator Biden, as chairman of the Foreign Relations Committee, is not with us. But obviously we're - both Chuck and I are thrilled to be going there with him and all together.
SENATOR HAGEL: I would add to what Senator Kerry has noted, that when you look at this part of the world, South Asia, and the four countries that we will be visiting, including Turkey, they represent very important allies for the United States.
And this is a very combustible, complicated region of the world. And when you further examine this region, you find that Iran is located right there, with Turkey to its north and on the other side of it Afghanistan, Pakistan, India. And so the regionalization and understanding the regional dynamics of what's going on there and consequences for not just the United States, but the region and the world of developments there are going to be important.
And this election in Pakistan certainly is going to be one of those important events that will occur that will affect relationships. Certainly the concerns that were expressed at the Senate Foreign Relations Committee hearing recently, that John mentioned, on Afghanistan are more indications that this is a very, very unsettled and insecure region of the world.
We've got two nuclear powers in this part of the world - India and Pakistan - and possibly an aspiring nuclear power in Iran. That's another dimension that adds to the danger here and the complications. So we, all of us in the United States, need to pay attention to this part of the world. And that's another reason that the three of us are going to spend a week there. Thanks, John.
SENATOR KERRY: Any questions? Thank you, Chuck. Appreciate it.
OPERATOR: You can all unmute your phones now by pressing pound- five. Thank you.
(Cross talk.)
SENATOR KERRY: Happy to entertain any questions. Just say who you are and put your question to whoever you want to.
Q (Name and affiliation inaudible.) This is for Senator Kerry. Sir, it appears that already State Department has lowered expectations towards the election, saying that it will be somewhere on a scale of terrible to great, somewhere in between. What would be free and fair elections to you and your colleagues, sir?
SENATOR KERRY: Well, you know, I've been on prior election observer efforts to the West Bank. I've been in the Philippines, elsewhere. I think you measure that when you get on the ground and you talk to the various parties concerned and really observe the procedures that have been put in place.
There are other observers who are going to be there. The European observers are going to be there and others. We will be meeting with them also and taking stock from them. And I think basically a consensus tends to develop pretty quickly among all the participants as to what's happening.
The standard obviously is that the votes are properly counted, that people have access to the polls, that there is no intimidation, there is not a denial of voting rights, and of course that the way the ballots are kept and counted is transparent and accountable. Those are the standards that ought to be applied so that people will be able to stand up and say, yes, this was a free and fair election. And we'll have to wait till we get on the ground before we do that.
But all of us have urged, you know, Senator Biden, myself, Senator Hagel, others, the administration have all spoken about the imperative of Pakistan having elections that are fair and that can be measured. And it's very important for the government, for its legitimacy, whatever government emerges, for that to occur.
SENATOR HAGEL: Exactly right.
SENATOR KERRY: Chuck, you want to add anything, or -
SENATOR HAGEL: No, I think you said it, John.
Q Just a quick supplemental question to that.
So in that case, who would you believe? Government will have a different story; people will have a different story. How - what might be the reaction if there are allegations of mass-scale rigging?
SENATOR KERRY: Well - Senator Hagel, do you want to take that? I mean, look -
SENATOR HAGEL: Well, I think, you know, we can get into all day long what ifs and scenarios. But I think at this point let's go forward with the expectations that Senator Kerry noted, that we all have in this country and, I think, in the world, and let's focus on free, fair, transparent elections. And then if we don't see that, then we'll deal with the consequences of that. But I don't see any value in going through what will we do, or could we do if this happens or if that happens.
SENATOR KERRY: I agree completely with that.
Q Thank you, sir.
SENATOR KERRY: Anything else?
Q Paul Eckert, from the?
Q Senators?
Q Oh, go ahead.
Q I'm sorry. This is Viola Geinger from Bloomberg News. I'm sorry. I joined just a few minutes late. I didn't hear which senator was talking about the - talking all day long about what ifs?
SENATOR HAGEL: You mean, the last - that was me, I assume, Senator Hagel, with the last comment there.
Q Thank you. I just want to follow up on that, the idea of the expectations here. I mean, how high are your expectations? Obviously, you know, you want to shoot for the most free, fair and transparent, as you've said, but what do you really expect?
SENATOR HAGEL: Well, we expect free, fair and transparent elections. Senator Kerry may want to respond if you didn't hear his comments before I made mine. And he did address that, and he made it very clear. And I'll step back here for a moment, and if he wants to restate what he said for your benefit, he'll do that.
But he made it very clear that the State Department, the United States, our government, all members of Congress, our country, the president has stated very clearly that we expect to see free, fair and transparent elections. It obviously redounds to the credibility and trust and the legitimacy of the government of Pakistan and their ability to be able to govern and their ability to be able to deal with the rest of the world.
SENATOR KERRY: Let me emphasise, also, for the - the stakes are very high here. And I hope the government understands that merely clinging to power meets nobody's objectives, because it will wind up actually playing into the hands of radicals and of the instability not only of the country but of the region.
And so having that transparency and fairness of an election is really vital to being able to deal with the challenges that the region now is confronting. And if you want to aid those who would disrupt and if you want to aid and give, you know, reason for violence and chaos and other things, it is to, you know, proceed down the darker side of that election scale that you've just - that we were asked about.
So I think it's - I hope that President Musharraf and the government and all those responsible for administering the elections are committed to the importance of this moment.
Q Senators, Joseph Morton here with the Omaha World-Herald. Two questions. First, I'm wondering what effect, if any, do you think your presence there will have on the elections. I mean, is this just to gather information for you guys, or do you think, as observers, you'll actually have some effect on the transparency of the elections?
And also if you could talk a little bit about the level of security that you guys will have while you're there - you mentioned that it's obviously a very combustible region and situation. So -
SENATOR HAGEL: Well - Joe, this is Senator Hagel. I'll respond first. Taking one of the questions that you ask about our presence there, obviously three United States senators are not going to dictate the terms of the election, nor the conduct of the election. We recognise that.
But what I think this does say to the world and show the world - that three senior United States senators are there to not only observe but just by our presence have some impact on understanding the interest and the importance of our country and the Pakistani elections and how those elections relate to this Pakistani-US relationship, as well as the rest of the region and the world.
And I've always believed that having senior officials from governments observe and be part of - in the sense of being on the ground during the elections - is important. And it does indicate not just, again, the interest, but also a sense of participation. We can't vote, nor are we going to vote, but participating in being there and part of that process. So I think that's probably the most that you can expect out of these.
But I don't think it goes unnoticed to the world, nor is it unnoticed or irrelevant to the people of Pakistan, that we're there. Not to overstate the importance of the three of us, certainly, but I think it does make a statement.
As to security, obviously, that's always an issue in some of these areas, in particular Afghanistan, but I know all three of us have great confidence in United States security professionals, as well as the Pakistanis who will be - and Afghanis and others who will be responsible for our security. I don't think that's anything that any of us are that concerned about.
Q Senators, this is Viola Gienger at Bloomberg?
SENATOR HAGEL: John, did you want to respond to that?
SENATOR KERRY: Oh, I think you did - that's great.
SENATOR HAGEL: Okay.
SENATOR KERRY: Thanks.
Q Are you planning to meet with President Musharraf before the election? And what about other candidates or party leaders?
SENATOR KERRY: Well, I think it's important that - first of all, the schedule is going to remain private at the moment. And we are meeting with all the major leaders, including President Musharraf, but I think it's important that the timing of those things and the whereabouts of those things just remain private at this time.
Q Senators, Paul Eckert of Reuters News Agency in Washington?
SENATOR KERRY: Let me say, first of all, I think it is important to say we will not meet with President Musharraf prior to the election because we don't want to have any semblance of any involvement within the election process. So whatever meetings we have will be after the observer part of the process.
Q Uh-huh. Okay, thank you.
Q Paul Eckert of the Reuters News Agency. Particularly Senator Kerry, the various studies that came out, and partly under your aegis a couple weeks ago, that were aired out in the hearing, both the informal presentation and the hearing I attended - they were very useful projects. One of them, called Afghanistan, I believe, "the forgotten war." And I wanted to ask you, in the context of what you're doing in these coming days, do you think there is the appetite, the political appetite, for a sustained US support for what's - you know, the battle in Afghanistan and Pakistan because, again, it was called the forgotten war for that - for the reason, the sense is that it's been flagging. And you know, the extremists -
SENATOR KERRY: Well, I don't think the American people - I mean, I think when many of us - when Senator Biden, Senator Hagel, myself have persistently pointed out the priority that has existed in Afghanistan and in the region, which we have felt consistently for several years now has not been properly focused on and attended to - the diversion of the effort to Iraq over Afghanistan, we have all stated many times, we think was a major blunder and has cost us enormously in momentum and in initiative on the ground.
So I think that that's been documented now by General Jones and by Ambassador Abshire and others who have reported. The key here is to try to get this right. I mean, all of us are committed to helping to raise people's understanding of the stakes in this region. And that's part of the reason for our making this trip together, is to try to underscore, in a bipartisan way - I emphasise "bipartisan way" - the importance of the refocusing and getting it right.
So it certainly hasn't been forgotten by the families that are there - you know, of the troops that are there. It's not forgotten by the troops themselves, who have behaved - who have performed extraordinarily. And it's not forgotten by many of us. But we believe the administration has simply not placed enough emphasis on the region.
I think that's improving. Secretary Rice was there just the other day. They are trying to get an envoy in place. There is an additional complement of Marines that are going. But this is late and, you know, questionable whether or not it's going to be sufficient in the context of what's happening. And that's part of why we're going, is to find out for ourselves whether or not it is or isn't, to ask the tough questions and to get a firsthand view.
Chuck?
SENATOR HAGEL: I agree with everything Senator Kerry said.
Q Senators, I'd like to ask a(n) India-related question. This is Somini Sengupta from The New York Times.
SENATOR KERRY: Yes. Hi, Somini. How are you?
Q Hi. Very well, thanks. What message are you planning to send to Prime Minister Singh about Iran - you mentioned some of your concerns about Iran - and also about the pending US-India nuclear agreement?
SENATOR KERRY: Well, India made its own decision to pull back a little on the pending agreement, and one of the things we will want to ascertain - I mean, a lot of us went out on the limb and were involved in that process. I was over there a year or so ago. We had discussions about it. And then some of us were surprised by that pullback after the extent to which we all went to try to help advance that effort. So we'll want to explore where we stand on that and what the thinking is about it. We - what was the other part of question?
Q On Iran, what message to India about its relations with Iran?
SENATOR KERRY: Well, Iran, we're all concerned about Iran. I mean, all of us are. And we want to find the best route to create a multilateral response that is cohesive and effective. That requires, obviously, co-operation with China and Russia also, as well as the European community - the Germans and British particularly, and French, who have been very involved in it - and we very much need to see sort of where they see any hurdles to that and how co-operative they're prepared to be. And that's - again, that's exactly why we are going there, is to explore their thinking. And there's nothing like the ability to be able to explore it firsthand, where you can actually have a conversation privately and get into the meat of these things and understand where they may have a reservation, where they don't, what their sense of the equation is that works and why. And all of those are the things we want to explore.
May I say also that, as somebody who's been deeply involved on the global climate change issue, I want to particularly raise with them the importance of their participation on the global climate change talks. And their - you know, their dependency on coal and their current energy demands pose us all with a huge challenge, and we need to raise the level of dialogue on that quite significantly.
Chuck?
Q Are you disappointed with India's position so far on climate change?
SENATOR KERRY: Excuse me?
Q Are you disappointed with India's position so far on climate change?
SENATOR KERRY: I'm not - I'm not going to express any opinion whatsoever before I have the conversations with them about that. But I think it's critical.
I have said publicly - I was in Bali at the climate change talks, and we've been very clear that this will require a global solution. And the key is going to be giving life to the words shared, common, shared but differentiated responsibilities.
And what I want to explore with them is their sense of what those are, and we'll see where we come out.
SENATOR HAGEL: I would just add to what Senator Kerry has said that it's always important for nations to build relationships around common interests - define relationships based on agreements and based on those common interests, not on defining a relationship with our differences. We have many common interests with India. We have many common interests with the nations of South Asia, including Pakistan.
The nuclear agreement that has been noted I have supported from the beginning, as Senator Kerry has, Senator Biden and others, because we felt it was clearly in the interest of the United States and India and the world. And that is an area that, obviously, we here in the United States have become concerned about because we're seeing difficulties develop within the Indian government on this. And as Senator Kerry has noted, we want to talk with the prime minister and others about this issue because it does cut across all of the most important and significant lines of our interests, including energy, including the environmental issues, including India's relationship with Iran, stability and peace in that area, certainly the relationship with Pakistan.
So we have got a very significant universe of common interests here with India that we need to enhance and we need to build on and try to strengthen as we go forward. And these kinds of visits and exchanges help do that.
SENATOR KERRY: Anybody else?
Q Yes, just one more. This is Viola at Bloomberg again. The follow-up on the India nuclear agreement. What is your understanding, from the US side, on where this nuclear agreement is now, in the Indian sort of domestic arena? How - I mean, it's been months since it sort of got mired - bogged down there. And also what's your understanding about whether there is any objection remaining within the Nuclear Suppliers Group toward that approval?
SENATOR KERRY: Well, it's - the last conversation I had with Nick Burns about it was a few months ago. And he said that they were engaged in dialogue, and seeking, you know, clarification as to how it proceeds forward, that they were working it through. They saw it as still on the table, that's where it stood, and I have not heard anything since then.
SENATOR HAGEL: I think I would just add to that that, as you know, there is a process here. And certainly the parliament has a political, critically important political piece of this for India. But also the IAEA is involved in negotiating the last aspects of this agreement with them, as well as the Suppliers Group, and getting final signoffs there. So all those pieces are still in play as far as I know. And it's a process that we need to make sure continues to go forward in a positive way.
SENATOR KERRY: Anybody else? One more?
Q Can I ask the last question, please, on Pakistan, Senator Kerry? (Name and affiliation inaudible)
When you go to the polling stations, will it be with the government officials? Or will it, I mean, wherever they want to take you? Or will it be your independent decision where you want to go?
SENATOR KERRY: We have some desires as to where we'd like to go. And for obvious reasons, we're not going to lay those out here now. But no, that's all being set up by our folks on the ground. And we intend to try to go where we think it's important to make a determination, and not to be led somewhere where we get a misimpression.
Q Thank you, Senator.
SENATOR KERRY: Appreciate it.
Q Senator Kerry. (Name and affiliation inaudible.)
SENATOR KERRY: Yeah. This has to be the last one, I think, unless Chuck wants to -
Q Okay, fast.
SENATOR KERRY: Yeah.
Q Right.
I just had a question on topics of conversation with President Musharraf. I was wondering if you all were going to discuss nuclear security at all.
SENATOR KERRY: Absolutely. That will be part of the discussion. Sure.
Q Great. Thank you very much.
(Cross talk)